Denzity Insights: Real Estate Research Like A Pro With Anthony Wong

Real Estate Research Like A Pro With Anthony Wong

Conducting proper research can be key to a successful real estate investment as it has a huge role to play in several ways. That’s why it is important to know where and how to get the correct information since data is often inaccessible to many. Therefore, we decided to cover this topic with Anthony Wong, a real estate research expert.

  • Methods & sources that investors should leverage
  • The process of assessing the different type of projects
  • When conducting research in emerging market

▶ Connect with Anthony:

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/anthony-wong-8ba67080/

▶ Source & Supporting:

Realinflo: https://www.realinflo.com

Colliers International: https://www2.colliers.com/en

Real Capital Analytics: https://www.rcanalytics.com

Buildings Department: https://www.bd.gov.hk/en/index.html

Data Centre: A data centre is an enclosed space where everything related to data is stored and handled inside mass number of computers, devices through many servers and networks.

https://www.paloaltonetworks.com/cyberpedia/what-is-a-data-center

APR: APR or annual percentage rate is the percentage of the amount that the borrower needs to pay to the lender per year.

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/a/apr.asp

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As it can be difficult to catch some minor errors, transcripts may contain a few typos or inaccuracies.

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Alright, let’s get back to the transcript of the show. Enjoy!

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Anthony Wong_ep24

[00:00:00] [00:00:00] Darren Wong: [00:00:00] Well, Anthony, welcome to the show.

[00:00:00][00:00]Darren Wong:[00:00:00]好吧,安東尼,歡迎收看節目。

[00:00:04]Anthony Wong: [00:00:04] Hi, it’s a pleasure to be here.

[00:00:04]安東尼·王:[00:00:04]嗨,很高興來到這裡。

[00:00:06] Darren Wong: [00:00:06] Yeah. So, I think we met a couple months ago

[00:00:06]Darren Wong:[00:00:06]是的。我想我們幾個月前見過面

[00:00:10] through our friend Gary from a RealInflo. And then I remember when we talked about having the show, and then your background is very good

[00:00:10]通過我們的朋友加里從一個真正的流入。我記得我們談過舉辦這個節目的時候,你的背景很好

[00:00:20] because our show is about helping audiences to learn about how to make better judgement, and better-informed decisions when it comes to real estate investing. So, if someone from your background have

[00:00:20]因為我們的節目旨在幫助觀眾瞭解如何在房地產投資方面做出更好的判斷和更明智的決策。所以,如果你背景的人

[00:00:30] the knowledge professionally, and have a very broad view of different location, how to think about investment is something that I’m really happy that you’re here to share with everyone here.

[00:00:30]專業的知識,對不同的地點有著非常廣闊的視野,如何思考投資是我非常高興的事情,你能在這裡與大家分享。

[00:00:40] [00:00:40] Anthony Wong: [00:00:40] Yeah, certainly. I mean, it’s a pleasure, get to know to Gary, who actually worked in my company before he came in and did a little

[00:00:40][00:00:40]安東尼·王:[00:00:40]是的,當然。我是說,很高興認識加里,他來之前在我公司工作過,做過一些事情

[00:00:50] presentation and modelling about his business line, RealInflo. If you haven’t checked out it, it’s a real estate platform, basically an extract of different real estate

[00:00:50]關於他的業務線,真實流入的演示和建模。如果你還沒看過,那就是一個房地產平臺,基本上是不同房地產的摘錄

[00:01:00] information, combining every data platform into one. Yeah, to start off with I’ve given introduction of myself. I’m Anthony Wong. I’m currently a research

[00:01:00]資訊,將每個數據平臺組合為一個。是的,首先我做了自我介紹。我是安東尼王。我現在在做研究

[00:01:10] manager at Colliers International. My education is that I have a master’s degree in real estate development. And previously, I’ve worked in China, and US

[00:01:10]高力國際的經理。我的教育是取得房地產開發碩士學位。以前,我在中國和美國工作過

[00:01:20] and now in Hong Kong. And I’ve worked in developers, which is client side and the consultancy side. I’ve also worked in several smaller startup side projects

[00:01:20]現在在香港。我在開發商工作過,也就是客戶方和諮詢方。我也曾參與過一些小型的創業項目

[00:01:30] previously, when I was interning during my university. So, for my current role, my responsibilities include writing research reports, managing

[00:01:30]以前,我在大學實習的時候。所以,對於我現時的角色,我的職責包括撰寫研究報告,管理

[00:01:40] database, as well as supporting a local team to execute client projects. So, every single quarter, as you know, there’s four quarters a year, and we have to produce

[00:01:40]資料庫,以及支持本地團隊執行客戶項目。所以,每個季度,如你所知,一年有四個季度,我們必須生產

[00:01:50] four reports per year, including retail, industrial, office and capital markets. So, one of the more interesting projects, which we’ll talk in a later

[00:01:50]每年四份報告,包括零售、工業、辦公和資本市場。所以,一個更有趣的項目,我們將在稍後討論

[00:02:00] episode is that data centre, we’ve recently published a research radar report on data centre market in Hong Kong, about smart technology, IOTs,

[00:02:00]關於資料中心,我們最近發佈了一份關於香港資料中心市場的研究雷達報告,關於智慧科技、物聯網,

[00:02:10] and how that is driving demand of higher data usage and what kind of sectors is changing in the upcoming years because it is gaining a lot attraction. And

[00:02:10]這是如何推動對更高數據使用率的需求的,以及在未來幾年中,哪些行業正在發生變化,因為它正變得越來越有吸引力。以及

[00:02:20] we’ll talk more about that in terms of industrial conversion, development, acquisition in the later chapter. But I’m happy to talk about my experience background. And now go back to you, Darren.

[00:02:20]我們將在後面的章節中從產業轉型、發展、收購等方面進行更多討論。但我很樂意談談我的經歷背景。現在回到你身邊,達倫。

[00:02:30] [00:02:30] Darren Wong: [00:02:30] Yeah, well, thanks for sharing because, I think when we prepping the show, and then you talked about we start with having one episode about how to do a better research, how

[00:02:30][00:02:30]Darren Wong:[00:02:30]是的,謝謝你的分享,因為,我想當我們準備節目的時候,你說我們從一集開始講如何做更好的研究,怎麼做

[00:02:40] to understand about investing overseas or locally. And then you mentioned data centre, where same time is that a lot of my friends are looking to data centre to invest or look into how to

[00:02:40]瞭解海外或本地投資。然後你們提到了資料中心,同時我的很多朋友都在找資料中心投資或者研究如何投資

[00:02:50] restructure it, which that’s why we dedicated for two different episodes for this. So, let’s start with the research side, because I think the information is interesting. So, for the

[00:02:50]重組它,這就是為什麼我們為此專門製作了兩個不同的劇集。所以,讓我們從研究方面開始,因為我認為這些資訊很有趣。所以,為了

[00:03:00] audience who might not be familiar, would you mind explaining what a real estate researcher does? And what a typical day would be?

[00:03:00]可能不太熟悉的觀眾,您介意解釋一下房地產研究員的工作嗎?那會是什麼樣的一天呢?

[00:03:07] Anthony Wong: [00:03:07] Yeah, for sure. I mean, in real estate

[00:03:07] Anthony Wong: [00:03:07]當然可以。我是說,在房地產領域

[00:03:10] research, you really get touch upon in different areas of things, not only just in real estate, you have to understand economics, stock market,

[00:03:10]研究,你會接觸到不同領域的事情,不僅僅是在房地產領域,你必須瞭解經濟學、股票市場,

[00:03:20] interest rates, all kinds of stuff. So, you have to be really, really aware of what’s happening in the economy, and everywhere, basically. So typically, I start off my day with reading

[00:03:20] 利率,各種各樣的東西。所以,你必須真正地,真正地意識到經濟中正在發生的事情,以及所有地方,基本上。所以我通常從閱讀開始我的一天

[00:03:30] a lot of market news, like Bloomberg, Routers, SCMP, HKEJ, or even local news like that, just to get a sense of how the economy is doing that

[00:03:30]很多市場新聞,比如彭博社、路由器、SCMP、HKEJ,甚至是當地的新聞,只是想瞭解一下經濟是如何運作的

[00:03:40] day or that quarter or that month. And after just reading news off it, it really depends what kind of project I’m working on. For example, in the

[00:03:40]某日或該季度或該月。在剛剛讀過新聞之後,這取決於我在做什麼樣的項目。例如,在

[00:03:50] past quarter, we published four quarterly reports, if you haven’t checked out, go to our Colliers International website, and it has the four sectors indicating

[00:03:50]過去一個季度,我們發佈了四個季度報告,如果您還沒有查看,請訪問我們的高力國際網站,上面有四個部門顯示

[00:04:00] how the market is doing. So yes, the four core markets we talked about is office, retail, industrial and capital markets. For office, it’s really, for us,

[00:04:00]市場情况如何。所以,是的,我們談到的四個覈心市場是辦公、零售、工業和資本市場。為了辦公室,真的,為了我們,

[00:04:10] as a researcher, every single month, we have to go through monthly meetings without brokers to understand how the rental changes are doing,

[00:04:10]作為一名研究員,每個月,我們都要在沒有經紀人的情况下召開月度會議,以瞭解租金的變化情况,

[00:04:20] what are the tenancy arrangements, what the vacancy rates, who are moving in and out of these new leases. For example, in Central and core areas in the past couple of

[00:04:20]租賃安排是什麼,空置率是多少,這些新租約的入住者和搬出者。例如,在中央和覈心區

[00:04:30] months, seeing a lot of changes because of the trade wars, the COVID-19, all that kind of market turbulence going on. So really keeping

[00:04:30]幾個月來,由於貿易戰,COVID-19,所有的市場動盪都在發生。所以真的

[00:04:40] close intact with the brokers, with the market players is really important on our daily flow. In terms of retail side, yes, you have

[00:04:40]與經紀人、市場參與者保持完整的關係對我們的日常交易流非常重要。在零售方面,是的,你有

[00:04:50] to get in close touch with the brokers, but not only that, you have to do a lot of self-research. So, for me recently, I published retail reports. We have to

[00:04:50]要與經紀人保持密切聯繫,但不僅如此,你還需要做大量的自我調查。最近,我發佈了零售報告。我們必須

[00:05:00] understand retail sales, we have to understand exports, imports, where are the sort of goods coming in, and how are the vacancy rates responding to

[00:05:00]瞭解零售銷售,我們必須瞭解出口、進口、商品種類以及空置率如何應對

[00:05:10] that. And also understanding incoming travellers, visitor travellers demand, when you look at it, almost 70 to 80%, back then all the travellers are from Mainland China,

[00:05:10]那個。同時也瞭解到入境旅客,旅客的需求,如果你看一下,差不多有70%到80%的旅客來自中國大陸,

[00:05:20] so they buy a lot of luxury goods. But now the trends are changing, it’s more like necessities, supermarkets are doing really well. No longer luxurious goods are doing well in the market right now. So

[00:05:20]所以他們買了很多奢侈品。但現在趨勢在變,更像是生活必需品,量販店的生意真的很好。現在市場上不再是奢侈品了。所以

[00:05:30] really being able to, and that’s why going back to the point reading market means understanding how the economy is going and reflected a research report. Industrial, as I talked about, it’s going through a

[00:05:30]真正能够做到這一點,這就是為什麼回到重點閱讀市場意味著瞭解經濟發展情况並反映出一份研究報告。工業,就像我說的,它正在經歷一個

[00:05:40] lot of changes as well. As you know, as a lot of people do know the supplies really limited. It’s not as substantial as

[00:05:40]還有很多變化。正如你所知道的,很多人都知道供應確實有限。它沒有實質性的

[00:05:50] residential, where there’s a high demand, but industrial is going to go through a big change in terms of the higher demand for data centres, the higher demand for higher

[00:05:50]住宅區,那裡的需求很高,但工業區將經歷一場巨大的變化,即對資料中心的需求越高,對資料中心的需求就越高

[00:06:00] quality industrial buildings, and a better location in support of that. And lastly but not, capital markets. That used to be one of the largest revenues [00:06:10] stream and consultancies, really trying to find big buyers. I mean, you can buy a billion dollar, a

[00:06:00]優質的工業建築,以及更好的位置來支持這一點。最後但不是資本市場。這曾經是stream和consultancies收入最大的公司之一,真的在尋找大買家。我是說,你可以買10億美元的15個幫手

[00:06:20] billion-dollar transaction and be a broker, and in between, you can get a big commission and back, it gives the companies a big portion of revenue during good times.

[00:06:20]10億美元的交易,做個經紀人,在這期間,你可以得到一大筆傭金,然後再回來,這會給公司帶來很大一部分的收入。

[00:06:30] But in tougher times, it’s tougher. So, the capital markets right now we’re really trying to help them to find distressed assets. Selling, advising our capital markets team to

[00:06:30]但在更艱難的時候,情况會更艱難。所以,資本市場現在我們真的在努力幫助他們找到不良資產。建議我們的資本市場團隊

[00:06:40] advise the clients where to buy properties. Hotel sector is a good one, because hotel is really having really low APR rate. So, giving them a really

[00:06:40]建議客戶在哪裡購買房產。酒店業是個不錯的行業,因為飯店的年利率確實很低。所以,給他們一個真正的

[00:06:50] good perspective and good direction in terms of how they deal with their clients and giving them a lot of resources is what I do on a daily basis. And I’m

[00:06:50]在如何與客戶打交道方面,以及給他們提供大量資源方面,我每天都要做的就是要有良好的視角和良好的方向。我是

[00:07:00] really happy to be part of the team and giving support our various brokers team.

[00:07:00]非常高興成為團隊的一員,並為我們的各個經紀人團隊提供支援。

[00:07:05] Darren Wong: [00:07:05] it sounds like a lot, a lot of reading and understanding. Because not only there you are being an

[00:07:05]Darren Wong:[00:07:05]聽起來有很多,很多閱讀和理解。因為你不僅在那裡

[00:07:10] economist, you’re being on the ground, talking to someone like broker in the forefront, and then you have to keep learning every single day. And not only real estate, right? Because real estate is a

[00:07:10]經濟學家,你在實地工作,和像經紀人這樣的人在前線交談,然後你每天都要不斷學習。不僅僅是房地產,對吧?因為房地產是

[00:07:20] big, big sector, but then the ecosystem with stocks, equity, debt, there’s so many neurons that you have to juggle with. And obviously, like not all the audience

[00:07:20]龐大的行業,但是在股票、股票、債務的生態系統中,有太多的神經元需要你去處理。顯然,不像所有的觀眾

[00:07:30] had the luxury that they can sit down and learn about these things every single day. But then it seems like it’s good to have someone like you to weave out and say, “hey, let’s make something very simple, ABCD,

[00:07:30]他們每天都可以坐下來學習這些東西。不過,有你這樣的人來編織,然後說,“嘿,讓我們把事情做得很簡單,ABCD,

[00:07:40] how to do it,” and then maybe, in the future, you become a researcher, you can do a lot more of that. So, being in the professional firms, what are some sources of knowledge that you can access

[00:07:40]如何做到這一點,“也許將來,你成為一名研究人員,你可以做更多的工作。那麼,在專業公司裏,你能獲得哪些知識來源

[00:07:50] to, which the audience might not gain access? Or have a harder time to have those knowledges?

[00:07:50]到,觀眾可能無法訪問這些內容?或者更難掌握這些知識?

[00:07:57] Anthony Wong: [00:07:57] Yeah, for sure. I mean, as a researcher, we

[00:07:57]安東尼·王:[00:07:57]是的,當然。我是說,作為一個研究者,我們

[00:08:00] do you have access to certain amount of knowledge that the public don’t have. But actually, majority of the resources that we do get is actually free to the public, and

[00:08:00]你能接觸到公眾所沒有的知識嗎。但實際上,我們得到的大部分資源實際上是免費的,而且

[00:08:10] just that the public are not aware of it. So, for example, besides our internal database, which we support our rentals

[00:08:10]只是公眾並不知道。例如,除了我們的內部審計資料庫,我們支持我們的租賃

[00:08:20] and vacancy every single month, for our office grade A brokerage team, which we provide different kinds of data. Yes, that is really kind of hard, difficult to

[00:08:20]並且每個月都有空缺,對於我們辦公室的甲級經紀團隊,我們提供不同種類的數據。是的,那真的有點難,很難

[00:08:30] retrieve because we manage our in-house database. But on top of that, things like land supply, land tender sells, those are all available in the market, for example, in the

[00:08:30]檢索,因為我們管理我們的內部資料庫。但除此之外,土地供應、土地招標出售等都是市場上可以買到的,例如

[00:08:40] lands apartment, you can go on the land sale section, and there’s different kinds of land tender documents, and you can look at different past bidders who bid at the land,

[00:08:40]土地公寓,你可以去賣地部分,那裡有不同種類的土地招標檔案,你可以看看不同的過去的競買人誰在等待土地,

[00:08:50] and what are the sort of trajectory. For example, most recently, there’s a lot of Chinese buyers, as you know, China Mobile just purchased an industrial site in ShaTin, a couple more sites

[00:08:50]軌跡是怎樣的。例如,最近有很多中國買家,你知道,中國移動剛剛在沙田購買了一個工業網站,還有幾個網站

[00:09:00] in Tuen Mun that various other Chinese companies. Understanding they’re not out there, but you just have to dig deeper into these websites. And

[00:09:00]在屯門,有許多其他中國包裹。瞭解他們不在那裡,但你只需要深入挖掘這些網站。以及

[00:09:10] another one is, if you have a piece of land, for example, investor, where do you go about to start up beside higher concern? Before you do due diligence, you can go on planning

[00:09:10]另一個問題是,如果你有一塊土地,比如說,投資者,除了更高的關注點之外,你要去哪裡創業?在你盡職調查之前,你可以繼續計畫

[00:09:20] department about outline zoning plan portal, which kind of shows you what are the limitations, restrictions regarding that area, for example, building heights, for example,

[00:09:20]關於分區規劃大綱的部門入口网站,它向您展示了該區域的限制和限制,例如,建築高度,

[00:09:30] zoning, for example, how many GFP that’s allowed. Plot ratio, that’s a good one. Really, it’s really available out there, but it’s really finding the sources. Another

[00:09:30]分區,例如,允許多少GFP。容積率,不錯。真的,它真的有,但它真的在尋找來源。另一個

[00:09:40] resource and knowledge that I gained access to, which a lot of people have heard of, is Real Capital Analytics. And that’s a subscription platform we do. And it’s mainly in

[00:09:40]我獲得的資源和知識,很多人都聽說過,是真正的資本分析。這是一個訂閱平臺。主要是在

[00:09:50] support of various valuation teams that we do have. And also capital markets team, for example, understanding what the recent transactions. What are the transactions that went over 4

[00:09:50]我們所擁有的各種評估團隊的支持。還有資本市場團隊,比如,瞭解最近的交易情况。超過4的交易有哪些

[00:10:00] billion dollars, for example, and what kind of market we are going for that specific lump sum or what the client is requesting. Another free

[00:10:00]億美元,比如說,我們要在什麼樣的市場上一次性付清,或者客戶要求什麼。另一個免費的

[00:10:10] platform, RCA, obviously, the one I talked about requires a sign up and you got to pay for it. But another free platform, I would say it’s really looking at the

[00:10:10]平臺,RCA,很明顯,我說的那個需要注册,你必須付費。但是另一個免費的平臺,我想說它真的在關注

[00:10:20] rating evaluation department, which they have a popping market statistics. We have all kinds of resources out there that could show you the trajectory of the

[00:10:20]評級評估部門,他們有一個快速的市場統計資料。我們有各種各樣的資源可以告訴你

[00:10:30] rental and capital value market flow. Another one is also the Buildings Department, if you want to look at the go-to-completion where the

[00:10:30]租金和資本價值市場流量。另一個也是建築部,如果你想看看要去哪裡完成的話

[00:10:40] progress instead of going on site and actually check out what’s going on. Actually, buildings apartments show you what are the progress in the development by telling you

[00:10:40]不是去現場,而是去看看到底發生了什麼。事實上,樓房公寓通過告訴你發展的進展來告訴你

[00:10:50] what kind of structure phase they are in. So, I think really this be resourceful. A lot of information is for your benefit, and the government do a really good job in terms of maintaining it. It’s really going

[00:10:50]他們處於什麼樣的結構階段。所以,我覺得這真的很有策略。很多資訊都是為了你的利益,政府在維護方面做得很好。真的很順利

[00:11:00] out there and find it and really have a strong, and maintain your own database, for example, what kind of sectors you’re going for, maintain it and have your own database in terms of going forward. I’m sure different

[00:11:00]找到它,然後真正擁有一個强大的資料庫,並維護您自己的資料庫,例如,您要選擇什麼樣的行業,維護它,並擁有自己的資料庫,以便未來發展。我肯定不一樣

[00:11:10] consultancies have different database, of course, but generally, they should be consistent in terms of the objectives supporting their local teams or their investment.

[00:11:10]當然,諮詢公司有不同的資料庫,但一般來說,他們應該在支持本地團隊或投資的目標方面保持一致。

[00:11:18] Darren Wong: [00:11:18] I see. I think

[00:11:18]Darren Wong:[00:11:18]我明白了。我想

[00:11:20] there’s a cool idea that was just in my head is that, in the end of this whole show, what we can do is to have some links, and some kind of guidance to people where they can find these data. And even the

[00:11:20]有一個很酷的想法就是,在整個節目的最後,我們可以做的是建立一些連結,並對人們在哪裡可以找到這些數據進行某種指導。甚至

[00:11:30] report you said just now about what you have issued recently, and so on, put them all on the show notes. The other cool idea, I mean, there are a lot of times

[00:11:30]你剛才說的關於你最近發佈的內容的報告,等等,把它們都寫在節目筆記上。另一個很酷的想法,我是說,有很多次

[00:11:40] because I used to be working in the real estate fund, and there are reports that we know where the reports are. But a lot of people, let’s say for the audience that might not be familiar real estate, just don’t know where to go. So, I think that

[00:11:40]因為我以前在房地產基金工作,有報導說我們知道報告在哪裡。但很多人,比如說對於觀眾來說可能並不熟悉房地產,只是不知道該去哪裡。所以,我認為

[00:11:50] even though having this kind of episode, pointing out, and then having those kinds of things in the show notes to tell people where they can get, is kind of useful. So just like what you said, there

[00:11:50]即使有這樣的插曲,指出,然後在節目筆記中寫上這些東西,告訴人們他們可以去哪裡,這是很有用的。就像你說的,好吧

[00:12:00] are a lot of different information and methods and sources, right? What kind of audience should leverage and then use it when it conducts market research analysis easily at the [00:12:10] moment?

[00:12:00]有很多不同的資訊、方法和來源,對嗎?在[00:12:10]這一刻,什麼樣的受眾在輕鬆進行市場調研分析時,應該利用並使用它?

[00:12:12] Anthony Wong: [00:12:12] Yeah, what I talked about leveraging is really about being resourceful. So what I talked about previously, besides some of the

[00:12:12]Anthony Wong:[00:12:12]是的,我所說的杠杆作用實際上是關於足智多謀。所以我之前說的,除了一些

[00:12:20] sources that I’ve mentioned previously, is really interacting closely with, as a researcher really, interacting closely with

[00:12:20]我之前提到的資源,作為一名研究人員,與他們的互動非常密切

[00:12:30] local brokers and consulting agents, and getting deeper insight in terms of, besides these data from this information, what is the story behind driving these data?

[00:12:30]此外,從這些經紀人那裡得到的更深入的資訊是什麼?

[00:12:40] For example, if the yields are coming down, or the capital values are going up, what is the reason behind it? Is it because

[00:12:40]例如,如果收益率下降,或者資本價值上升,那麼背後的原因是什麼?是因為

[00:12:50] buyers are withholding the asset price, at the same time the flexible lowering the rental prices? There’s all kinds of a trajectory that

[00:12:50]購房者在預扣資產價格的同時,靈活降低租賃價格?有各種各樣的軌跡

[00:13:00] explained the underlying story behind those numbers. Really kind of doing both qualitative, which I talked about interacting with the people on ground, and

[00:13:00]解釋了這些數位背後的故事。真的是既定性又定性,我談到了和地面上的人互動

[00:13:10] quantitative, which is getting the information from the platform. And what kind of storyline and what kind of trajectory, what kind of POV you giving into

[00:13:10]定量,即從平臺獲取資訊。什麼樣的故事情節,什麼樣的軌跡,什麼樣的觀點

[00:13:20] your research reports, and your local brokers team and your local valuation team? And I think there’s a lot of specific indicators out there: GDP,

[00:13:20]你的研究報告,你當地的經紀人團隊和你當地的評估團隊?我認為有很多具體的名額:GDP,

[00:13:30] employment market stock prices. These are great. But there’s got to be some relation back to the real estate market. What is the story telling?

[00:13:30]就業市場股票價格。這些都很棒。但一定和房地產市場有某種關係。這個故事講的是什麼?

[00:13:37] Darren Wong: [00:13:37] I see.

[00:13:37]Darren Wong:[00:13:37]我明白了。

[00:13:40] Would you mind explaining and providing a walkthrough on a process of different kinds of projects that you can start with, like you found on project new-built and second hand

[00:13:40]您介意解釋一下並提供一個關於不同類型項目的過程的演練,您可以從這些項目開始,就像您在新建項目和二手項目中發現的那樣

[00:13:50] assets. Because I think it’d be good idea to give people a framework and say, hey, if you’re looking for deployment project, this is the framework pretty easily how to find resources and maybe new built and see

[00:13:50]資產。因為我認為給人們一個框架,然後說,嘿,如果你在尋找部署項目,這是一個很容易找到資源和新建的框架

[00:14:00] second hand assets.

[00:14:00]二手資產。

[00:14:02] Anthony Wong: [00:14:02] Yeah, I think they’re quite different in terms of new development,

[00:14:02]Anthony Wong:[00:14:02]是的,我認為他們在新的發展方面是完全不同的,

[00:14:10] development project, new buildings, secondhand asset. They’re managed by different investors, different operators, sometimes in private equity they you do it all.

[00:14:10]開發專案、新建築、二手資產。它們由不同的投資者、不同的運營商管理,有時在私募股權中它們都由你來做。

[00:14:20] But I think development project, I think you start off with, well, I’m a researcher myself, so I’m going to give you a researcher POV, not from a developer

[00:14:20]但我認為開發專案,我認為你應該從,好吧,我自己是一個研究員,所以我要給你一個研究員的觀點,而不是一個開發者

[00:14:30] view. So, as I talked about, really go through the lands department seeing one of the attendant notices by the lands that have been issued by the government right now.

[00:14:30]視圖。所以,正如我所說的,真的要去地政總署看看政府現在發佈的一份土地通告。

[00:14:40] Being aware of the policy address, the budget reports, sometimes they talk about, oh, we are aiming, for example, this year, we’re aiming for

[00:14:40]知道施政報告,預算報告,有時他們會說,哦,我們的目標是,例如,今年,我們的目標是

[00:14:50] 80,000 residential units that’s being injected into the market. And obviously, realistic speaking, how much of that is actually being injected, how much of a goal, so you can analyse

[00:14:50]正在向市場注入80000套住宅。很明顯,從現實的角度來說,有多少是被注入的,有多少是一個目標,所以你可以分析

[00:15:00] that in the past historical performance and see, okay, just because the government said 90,000, actually, in the past, there’s only half that’s been issued for it because of different restrictions

[00:15:00]過去的歷史表現,好吧,就因為政府說9萬,實際上,在過去,因為不同的限制,只有一半是為它發放的

[00:15:10] and time delays and development projects. So, understanding a market from these public platforms, I think newbuilt same as development

[00:15:10]時間延遲和開發專案。所以,從這些公共平臺來理解一個市場,我認為新造和開發是一樣的

[00:15:20] project, look at the buildings department, look at the construction timeline, we, a lot of consulting firms manage their own

[00:15:20]項目,看看建築部,看看施工時間表,我們,很多諮詢公司自己管理

[00:15:30] supply pipeline. So, when it will see when are the buildings being completed. That’s really, really important. And see when is a timing coming in, where’s

[00:15:30]供應筦道。所以,它什麼時候能看到建築什麼時候完工。這真的非常重要。看看什麼時候時機到了,在哪

[00:15:40] the liquidity going? I think, in terms of second-hand asset, that ranges quite a lot. It’s really about the

[00:15:40]流動性如何?我認為,就二手資產而言,這個幅度相當大。真的是關於

[00:15:50] investment side, and the investment side of second-hand asset, is really about knowing your market links. For example, in the capital markets team, it’s really

[00:15:50]投資方面,以及二手資產的投資方面,實際上是瞭解你的市場聯系。例如,在資本市場團隊中

[00:16:00] knowing in depth connections that could lead you to some lucrative transactions. And as a researcher, we just have to analyse what are the great

[00:16:00]深入瞭解可能會導致您進行一些有利可圖的交易的深層次聯系。作為一個研究者,我們只需要分析什麼是偉大的

[00:16:10] transactions in the past, and how that reflects the value of that specific client is buying. So, we give as much information as we

[00:16:10]過去的交易,以及如何反映特定客戶的購買價值。所以,我們提供了盡可能多的資訊

[00:16:20] can in the second-hand asset market and let them decide where are the good project to go for some transaction?

[00:16:20]在二手資產市場,讓他們决定好的項目去哪裡進行交易?

[00:16:28] Darren Wong: [00:16:28] I guess [00:16:30] that’s pretty informative as people framework how to think about it. So, when we met up a couple months ago, and I think that we talked about your

[00:16:28]Darren Wong:[00:16:28]我想[00:16:30]在人們如何思考的框架下,這是一個相當豐富的資訊。所以,幾個月前我們見面的時候,我想我們討論過你

[00:16:40] experience in Greater Bay Area when you are researching in the area, and focusing on that, and I think it’s a great idea to use that as a use case to talk about how to conduct research in the

[00:16:40]當您在大灣區進行研究時,體驗一下該地區的情况,並將其作為一個案例來討論如何在

[00:16:50] emerging markets because a lot of audience might be interested in Malaysia asset b&m asset, and obviously, you’re more in the Greater Bay Area. So I want to talk about your experience with that.

[00:16:50]新興市場,因為很多觀眾可能對馬來西亞資產b&m資產感興趣,而且很明顯,你更多的是在大灣區。所以我想談談你的經歷。

[00:17:00] How is the experience with conducting research in emerging market like the Greater Bay Area? How does that process, is it different than having developed area, is it really hard to find information, many more?

[00:17:00]在大灣區等新興市場開展研究的經驗如何?這個過程和開發區有什麼不同嗎?真的很難找到更多的資訊嗎?

[00:17:11] [00:17:10] Anthony Wong: [00:17:11] Yeah, for sure. I mean, I was in China about a year or so. And really on the south side of China, which is the Greater Bay Area, which they call it.

[00:17:11][00:17:10]安東尼·王:[00:17:11]是的,當然。我是說,我在中國呆了一年左右。在中國的南邊,也就是大灣區,他們稱之為大灣區。

[00:17:20] So these cities included two core cities and nine other second tier cities. The two core, obviously, Shenzhen and Guangzhou, which my offices were based at

[00:17:20]所以這些都市包括兩個覈心都市和九個其他二線都市。很明顯,這兩個覈心,深圳和廣州,我的辦公室就在那裡

[00:17:30] when I was conducting research and advisory business there from another consulting firm. I think it’s a lot different doing research and doing development in China,

[00:17:30]當時我在另一家諮詢公司做研究和諮詢業務。我覺得在中國做研究和開發有很大不同,

[00:17:40] because in the sense that as a researcher, marketing transparency is not as great as Hong Kong. For example, maturity of real estate market information is really, really difficult to retrieve.

[00:17:40]因為從某種意義上說,作為一個研究者,市場行銷透明度不如香港。比如,房地產市場的成熟度資訊確實很難檢索。

[00:17:50] There’s no united platform, as I talked about things like EPRC, which shows all the transaction for not that expensive

[00:17:50]沒有統一的平臺,就像我談到的EPRC一樣,它顯示所有的交易,而不是那麼昂貴

[00:18:00] mountain subscription fee, or lands apartment or buildings department where you can just go directly and get the information. And so I think transparency is really a one big thing. They

[00:18:00]山地訂閱費,或土地公寓或建築部,您可以直接前往獲取資訊。所以我認為透明度是一件大事。他們

[00:18:10] do have a platform called CREIS, which is the China Real Estate Intelligence System. And that is a hefty heavy price subscription allowing real estate

[00:18:10]有一個叫做CREIS的平臺,就是中國房地產情報系統。這是一筆巨大的高價認購,允許房地產

[00:18:20] petitioners to gain access to, for example, land values, residential transaction. But again, the downside is that how much of that data is accurate in China, because

[00:18:20]申請者獲得土地價值、住宅交易等資訊。但另一方面,中國的數據有多少是準確的,因為

[00:18:30] sometimes data has always been something that we as a researcher is concerned about. So, doing real estate research, compared

[00:18:30]作為一名研究人員,有時數據一直是我們關心的問題。所以,做房地產研究,比較

[00:18:40] to Hong Kong, takes a lot more time in the sense that we have to, instead of just relying on the data, sometimes you have to go on site and verify, is this project completed, and is this

[00:18:40]到香港,需要更多的時間,因為我們必須,而不是僅僅依賴數據,有時你必須去現場核實,這個項目是否已經完成,這是不是

[00:18:50] development actually has that much of a tendency in terms of vacancy. So when I was working and travelling between two cities and

[00:18:50]發展實際上在空缺方面有很大的趨勢。所以當我在兩個城市之間工作和旅行時

[00:19:00] Shenzhen, give you an example. My team members and I have to visit a lot of undeveloped office sites. For example, in Guangzhou and the south side, there’s a

[00:19:00]深圳,舉個例子。我和我的團隊成員不得不參觀許多未開發的辦公地點。例如,在廣州和南區,有一個

[00:19:10] second tier city called Foshan, luckily, we had a company car so we can go there, but we have to actually visit these retail sites and see

[00:19:10]二線都市佛山,幸運的是,我們有一輛公司的車,所以我們可以去那裡,但我們必須去這些零售點看看

[00:19:20] what other vacancies going on there. And we have to talk to local brokers to understand what are the situation that’s been going on in the market in terms of retail,

[00:19:20] 那裡還有什麼空缺。我們必須和當地的經紀人談談,瞭解零售市場的情况,

[00:19:30] walking through different models and analysing the guesstimation of what the vacancy rates are because it’s hard to really, really retrieve those data in

[00:19:30]瀏覽不同的模型,分析空置率的猜測,因為很難真正、真正地檢索到這些數據

[00:19:40] China. So, I think doing research in China requires a lot of time, patience, years of experience, being in the market

[00:19:40]中國。所以,我認為在中國做研究需要大量的時間,耐心,多年的經驗,在市場上

[00:19:50] and really swimming along it and having deeper connections with the local investors. When you thought about doing China, relationships number one really important.

[00:19:50]並且真正地遊走於此,並與當地投資者建立了更深入的聯系。當你在做一個重要的關係的時候。

[00:20:00] So these clean market players, they give you a lot of insights in terms of making the job a lot easier.

[00:20:00]所以這些清潔市場的參與者,他們給了你很多關於讓工作更輕鬆的見解。

[00:20:06] Darren Wong: [00:20:06] I feel like we should ask Gary just to find the data for us,

[00:20:06]Darren Wong:[00:20:06]我覺得我們應該讓Gary幫我們找到數據,

[00:20:10] because there is so much hassle. And then I think there’s similar stories that when people told me about, when a couple years ago, half a half a decade ago, they

[00:20:10]因為麻煩太多了。我覺得有類似的故事,當人們告訴我,幾年前,5年前,他們

[00:20:20] went to Vietnam or Malaysia, same thing is that like, they have a very, very hard time. And obviously, right now because the demand is so high, they start building the whole infrastructure of data and information. But before that was

[00:20:20]去了越南或馬來西亞,同樣的事情是,他們的日子非常非常非常艱難。顯然,現在由於需求如此之高,他們開始構建數據和資訊的整個基礎設施。但在那之前

[00:20:30] really that, even you want to find out what’s going on, you got to be fly all the way there, be on the ground, you have to have two hours car ride, bumpy car ride, really measure

[00:20:30]真的,即使你想知道發生了什麼事,你也必須一路飛到那裡,趴在地上,你必須有兩個小時的車程,顛簸的車程,真正的量測

[00:20:40] every single thing to know what the hell is going on, because the data wasn’t there. So I think these are things that like office for emerging market, that’s the tricky part. And then which comes to

[00:20:40]每件事都要知道到底發生了什麼,因為沒有數據。所以我認為這些都像是新興市場辦公室,這是個棘手的問題。然後是哪一個

[00:20:50] the next question. What are some tips and insight you will share with the audience, especially when it comes to locally and abroad? Or in this case, emerging markets when the data is not as available?

[00:20:50]下一個問題。你將與觀眾分享哪些技巧和見解,尤其是在涉及本地和國外時?或者在這種情況下,新興市場的數據在什麼時候是不可用的?

[00:21:02] [00:21:00] Anthony Wong: [00:21:02] Yeah, I have worked in China, wouldn’t say a long time, and Hong Kong, a little more familiar with. I would say,

[00:21:02] [00:21:00] Anthony Wong: [00:21:02]對,再熟悉一點,我就不會在香港工作了。我會說,

[00:21:10] doing good research is about do what you can, honestly. Be open minded and resourceful, and talk to as many people, so if you want to go to a different

[00:21:10]誠實地說,做好研究就是盡你所能。思想開放,足智多謀,和盡可能多的人交談,所以如果你想去一個不同的地方

[00:21:20] country to do your investment, not just only ask a couple brokers, is this a good site to invest or are you took a plane trip there, and then

[00:21:20]國家做你的投資,不僅僅是問幾個經紀人,這是一個投資的好地方還是你坐飛機去那裡,然後

[00:21:30] “Oh, I like this place, that seems like a good vacation place”? But also really knowing the people, real estate is about community. So knowing what kind of location that

[00:21:30]“哦,我喜歡這個地方,那看起來是個不錯的度假勝地”?但也真正瞭解人,房地產是關於社區的。所以知道什麼樣的地點

[00:21:40] you’re intended to invest? What kind of community residents that gives you the sense of safety, sense of good education, good school boundaries? These are really, really important. And really make use of

[00:21:40]你打算投資?什麼樣的社區居民能給你安全感、良好的教育意識、良好的學校邊界?這些真的非常重要。真正地利用

[00:21:50] the resources that is provided by the local government. And Hong Kong, we’re really privileged to have a lot of resources that is issued out there. For emerging market, not so much, so

[00:21:50]當地政府提供的資源。而香港,我們真的很榮幸有很多資源是在那裡發行的。對於新興市場來說,不算太多,所以

[00:22:00] sometimes you might have to spend a little more time, a little more money, and a little more liquidity in terms of knowing the market or even worse. But the upside is that there’s more gains on

[00:22:00]有時候你可能需要花更多的時間、更多的錢和更多的流動性來瞭解市場,甚至更糟。但有利的一面是會有更多的收益

[00:22:10] top of saturated market like Hong Kong. Second of all, be really analytical and insightful. How to spot trends, as I talked about really read a

[00:22:10]香港等飽和市場的頂端。其次,要有分析力和洞察力。如何發現趨勢,就像我說的那樣

[00:22:20] lot of market news. Sometimes this news might give you a really good suspense, but how much is that actually reflecting the market, right? So really be

[00:22:20]很多市場新聞。有時候這條新聞可能會給你一個很好的懸念,但這實際上反映了市場多少,對吧?真的嗎

[00:22:30] critical in terms of some of news outlets. And also, be both quantitative and qualitative. Don’t just rely on data, rely on talking to different people and

[00:22:30]對一些新聞媒體來說很關鍵。而且,既要定量又要定性。不要只依賴數據,要依賴於與不同的人交談和

[00:22:40] understanding where the sources are coming. At the end of the day, you really start off real estate. Because real estate, everything

[00:22:40]瞭解資訊來源的來源。歸根結底,你真的要從房地產開始。因為房地產,一切

[00:22:50] is about location, right? So really understanding the locational context of it, from transportation, to building

[00:22:50]是關於位置的,對吧?所以要真正理解它的地理環境,從交通到建築

[00:23:00] highways, to geopolitical stability, to Macro, all kind of stuff. I think these are all really essential in terms of investing elsewhere in a place that you’re not

[00:23:00]高速公路,地緣政治穩定,Mac,各種各樣的東西。我認為這些都是投資其他地方的必要條件

[00:23:10] familiar with, for example, in emerging markets.

[00:23:10]熟悉新興市場。

[00:23:12] Darren Wong: [00:23:12] I think there’s a very good takeaway, because that’s something it’s easier said than done. It is a lot of homework, but you’ve got to do it because you’re

[00:23:12]Darren Wong:[00:23:12]我認為有一個非常好的外賣,因為這是說起來容易做起來難的事情。工作太多了,但你必須做,因為你

[00:23:20] putting years of savings into something that you might not get return or get a good return that is expected until years afterward. So before we jump into the

[00:23:20]把多年的積蓄投入到一些你可能得不到回報或是很好的回報的東西上,而這些東西要等到幾年後才能得到回報。所以在我們跳進

[00:23:30] data centre topic for the audience, maybe it just ends right here. How would they return to you to find out more about your work and yourself?

[00:23:30]針對觀眾的資料中心主題,也許就在這裡結束。他們會如何回到你身邊去瞭解你的工作和你自己?

[00:23:40] [00:23:39] Anthony Wong: [00:23:39] Yeah, for sure. So really, our work is really publicly available. You know, a lot of people don’t make use of it. We do a lot of consulting projects that you guys are

[00:23:40][00:23:39]安東尼·王:[00:23:39]是的,當然。所以說真的,我們的工作是公開的。你知道,很多人都不利用它。我們做了很多諮詢專案

[00:23:50] more welcome to check it out. It’s in the Colliers International website. And you go on, there’s a research tab that you click on research. And inside, there’s different sectors and you select

[00:23:50]歡迎大家來看看。在高力國際的網站上。你繼續,有一個研究標籤,你點擊研究。在裡面,有不同的區域,你可以選擇

[00:24:00] whatever region that you want to invest in, for example, you want to go with Malaysia, we have Malaysian quarterly reports that shows four or five different sectors office, industrial, retail, residential,

[00:24:00]無論你想投資哪個地區,例如,你想和馬來西亞一起投資,我們有馬來西亞的季度報告,顯示了四到五個不同的行業:辦公、工業、零售、住宅,

[00:24:10] capital markets that we publish reports consistently. So anyone who’s interested in the market, make use of the resource that we produce, because we want to help clients, we want to develop client relationships to

[00:24:10]我們一貫發佈報告的資本市場。所以任何對市場感興趣的人,都要利用我們生產的資源,因為我們想幫助客戶,我們想發展客戶關係

[00:24:20] go there. But honestly, we are really personal. So if you want to reach out to me personally, add me on LinkedIn, Anthony Wong. I’ve been called Colliers

[00:24:20]去那裡。但老實說,我們真的很私人。所以,如果你想親自聯系我,請在LinkedIn上加上我,安東尼·黃。我被稱為科利爾

[00:24:30] International, and you can find me there or reach out to my email via [email protected] I’m always able to help you find real estate

[00:24:30]國際,您可以在那裡找到我或通過安東尼·王@高力網.我總能幫你找房地產

[00:24:40] solutions or giving you just basic guidance in terms of career path, you want to go into the real estate or real estate research.

[00:24:40]解決方案或者只是在職業道路上給你一些基本的指導,你想要進入房地產或房地產研究。

[00:24:47] Darren Wong: [00:24:47] Yeah, obviously I’ll ensure all the links we

[00:24:47]Darren Wong:[00:24:47]是的,顯然我會確保我們所有的連結

[00:24:50] said before, the links for different public information and obviously Colliers, for example, the information you have, the report you have and the contact information. So for the people who are

[00:24:50]前面說過,不同公共資訊的連結,顯然是打給你的,比如你掌握的資訊、你掌握的報告和聯繫方式。所以對於那些

[00:25:00] interested to learn more about data centre, we are going to have a nice episode coming up within less than a week time, and then yeah, that’s it.

[00:25:00]有興趣瞭解更多有關資料中心的資訊,我們將在不到一周的時間內推出一集精彩的節目,然後是的,就這樣。

[00:25:07] Anthony Wong: [00:25:07] I’m looking

[00:25:07]安東尼·王:[00:25:07]我在找

[00:25:10] forward to it.

[00:25:10]前進。

[00:25:10] Darren Wong: [00:25:10] Yeah, for sure.

[00:25:10]Darren Wong:[00:25:10]是的,當然。

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